tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post3043294048973081135..comments2023-10-30T09:03:07.163-07:00Comments on California High Speed Rail Blog: Thanksgiving Open ThreadRobert Cruickshankhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comBlogger44125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-41316191678823984772009-11-28T21:03:26.523-08:002009-11-28T21:03:26.523-08:00All that information is available in the business...All that information is available in the <a href="http://www.cahighspeedrail.ca.gov/images/chsr/20081107134320_CHSRABusinessPlan2008.pdf" rel="nofollow">business plan</a>Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-80088090237059116032009-11-28T11:17:17.760-08:002009-11-28T11:17:17.760-08:00This doesn't have to do with the discussion, b...This doesn't have to do with the discussion, but I recently cam eacross a map on the Transit Coalition's website that shows the permitted speeds along each section of the HSR system. Between Palmdale and Bakersfield, it shows speed will be between 150 and 200mph. But since it's flat empty desert land, (up to Tehachapi at least) couldn't trains reach 220mph on this segment? This could probably help cut travel time.<br /><br />Here's the web page URL by the way: http://transittalk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=highspeed&action=display&thread=722HSRforCalinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-7803155870046857172009-11-28T10:53:00.420-08:002009-11-28T10:53:00.420-08:00In fact, I just changed it to blue. I think I like...In fact, I just changed it to blue. I think I like that better.Robert Cruickshankhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-49693168598143413762009-11-28T10:51:16.418-08:002009-11-28T10:51:16.418-08:00Anyone still looking at this open thread, have a l...Anyone still looking at this open thread, have a look at the <a href="http://www.cahsrblog.com/" rel="nofollow">new blog</a>. Avery Smith did some work to clean it up and I think it looks fantastic.<br /><br />The orange text should probably go, right? I'm thinking blue, to match the header image. Thoughts?<br /><br />(Note that the idea of orange text was entirely my own, so blame me for that.)Robert Cruickshankhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-19407645864124090852009-11-28T08:39:08.819-08:002009-11-28T08:39:08.819-08:00Time to give thanks California isn't Russia. T...Time to give thanks California isn't <a href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34175338/ns/world_news-europe/" rel="nofollow">Russia</a>. The derailed train was a conventional locomotive-hauled consist, but the tracks that were bombed are those also used by the Sapsan high speed train currently undergoing acceptance tests.<br /><br />The incident underlines the importance of sturdy fences and 24/7 CCTV surveillance of the right of way. A 15lb TNT equivalent bomb on board a train will kill/injure some number of passengers and damage one or two cars. The same bomb placed on the tracks will cause the entire train to derail.<br /><br />In addition, the incident underlines the importance of dealing with separatist terrorism on a political level. Russia has failed to engage with Chechen politicians to work out a deal for increased autonomy. Spain still has a problem with ETA, but it has become much smaller since it got France to co-operate in police actions and especially, since it granted far-reaching autonomy to the Basque country.Rafaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05471957286484454765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-43498904708061424362009-11-28T07:50:45.296-08:002009-11-28T07:50:45.296-08:00@ anon @ 11:49am -
the 2% number would apply if C...@ anon @ 11:49am -<br /><br />the 2% number would apply if CHSRA wanted to use FRA-compliant rolling stock. Lightweight, off-the-shelf but non-compliant equipment will only add 1% to total generating capacity installed in 2005.<br /><br />In hard numbers, the fully built-out network operating at full tilt would require no more than 480MW of generating capacity. For reference, the Geysers geothermal plant in Medocino is rated at about 1000MW, the Ivanpah solar thermal plant (9 sq mi) at 400MW.<br /><br />A single very large diameter wind turbine can deliver 2-3MW, so 160-240 units would be required. Not a trivial proposition by any means, but not impossible either. California is a very large state and there are a lot of places with consistently strong winds.<br /><br />Small hydro and biomass (especially biogas) can be used to supplement wind and solar power, especially if a significant number of distributed generating units are integrated into a single <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tR8gEMpzos4" rel="nofollow">virtual power plant</a>.<br /><br />As the report CHSRA commissioned notes, the biggest hurdle will not be technological or even economic feasibility but red tape and current grid management practices.<br /><br />Fortunately, it isn't even a requirement that the HSR system never ever consume a single kWH of power generated in conventional caloric power plants. For the purposes of AB32, it would be sufficient if utilities could prove (and independent auditors confirm) that they<br /><br />(a) installed additional renewable generating capacity rated at a total of 480MW and,<br /><br />(b) actually generated at least as many GWh from this additional capacity as was sold to the HSR operator(s), summed up over the course of a year.<br /><br />Ergo, if there's an excess of wind on one day, it can be used to supply electricity to the HSR system plus other consumers, who would otherwise have been supplied with juice from e.g. a gas-fired power plant.<br /><br />On another day, there might not be enough wind to support even the HSR system, so it's demand would have to met in part by burning fossil fuels on that day.<br /><br />Now, tally up the excess against the shortfall over the course of a year. If there's a net excess, the outcome is equivalent (in terms of CO2 emissions) to having supplied the HSR system exclusively with renewable electricity.Rafaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05471957286484454765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-19853666673925554682009-11-28T00:06:57.012-08:002009-11-28T00:06:57.012-08:00Here's the web page URL by the way: http://tra...Here's the web page URL by the way: http://transittalk.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=highspeed&action=display&thread=722HSRforCalinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-1710041953127327932009-11-28T00:06:15.013-08:002009-11-28T00:06:15.013-08:00This doesn't have to do with the discussion, b...This doesn't have to do with the discussion, but I recently cam eacross a map on the Transit Coalition's website that shows the permitted speeds along each section of the HSR system. Between Palmdale and Bakersfield, it shows speed will be between 150 and 200mph. But since it's flat empty desert land, (up to Tehachapi at least) couldn't trains reach 220mph on this segment? This could probably help cut travel time.HSRforCalinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-69422514371098979942009-11-27T23:03:59.278-08:002009-11-27T23:03:59.278-08:00@ HSRforCali
They have designs for both single- a...@ HSRforCali<br /><br />They have designs for both single- and double-tracked aerials.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-32874331673867074002009-11-27T23:00:39.534-08:002009-11-27T23:00:39.534-08:00It looks like the aerial structure only includes o...It looks like the aerial structure only includes one track. Maybe that's why it has a low construction cost.HSRforCalinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-45217022317353854882009-11-27T20:12:28.215-08:002009-11-27T20:12:28.215-08:00I must admit though, despite its technical flaws, ...I must admit though, despite its technical flaws, it's a nice departure from the usual "TUNNEL OR GTFO" mentality.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-65072087197626808152009-11-27T19:55:10.694-08:002009-11-27T19:55:10.694-08:00It could also be an option for vertical stacking f...It could also be an option for vertical stacking for those very short sections where the the ROW isn't wide enough for four tracks.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-7423310103245390162009-11-27T19:51:17.638-08:002009-11-27T19:51:17.638-08:00I can see the Bellomo Architects two-track design ...I can see the Bellomo Architects two-track design proposal being useful for other locations, such as the planned aerials for Morgan Hill or Gilroy.<br /><br />Otherwise, any option that doesn't grade separate Caltrain and freight is likely to be a non-starter.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-48940479110224808032009-11-27T19:42:28.979-08:002009-11-27T19:42:28.979-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-30355558948179633602009-11-27T19:32:31.578-08:002009-11-27T19:32:31.578-08:00Yeah, TBH I see no reason to separate the CalTrain...Yeah, TBH I see no reason to separate the CalTrain and HSR tracks, except where horizontal space is severely limited (which it isn't in this case). Plus, consider that putting tracks under an areal structure requires it to be higher than just putting road underpasses (as trains require a few more feet of vertical clearance, especially if electrification and/or Plate H freight are being used.<br /><br />I could still see those types of design principals being integrated into a four track solution though. If the two track solution REALLY only costs <a href="http://www.bellomoarchitects.com/pdf/Bellomo_HSR_for_SJB.pdf" rel="nofollow">$36m per mile</a> (50 miles=1.8b), then a four track solution is probably doable as well, well within budgetary constraints.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-29386158021906517412009-11-27T19:22:17.519-08:002009-11-27T19:22:17.519-08:00Nice effort, but their design is flawed in that th...Nice effort, but their design is flawed in that there's no reason why Caltrain can't run electric commuter trains with high speed trains. There's no reason to put them on different systems.Spokkerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03244298044953214810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-39484645202295475382009-11-27T19:16:44.329-08:002009-11-27T19:16:44.329-08:00Spokker:
Actually, right now Southwest's fuel...Spokker:<br /><br />Actually, right now Southwest's fuel hedge is a liability, after fuel prices have dropped. Southwest's fuel hedge was just that - a way of getting through $4/gallon gas.Alon Levyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12195377309045184452noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-76090089850415119442009-11-27T19:01:54.881-08:002009-11-27T19:01:54.881-08:00I like the design. It shows a local effort to com...I like the design. It shows a local effort to come up with an innovative, feasible, green, visually attractive, and locally acceptable solution. Unfortunately, it misses out on one thing: grade separating the CalTrain tracks. Nice otherwise though.<br /><br />And let me add another vote for the design competition idea.Joeyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16406340564037825796noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-41129026241191694872009-11-27T18:43:22.156-08:002009-11-27T18:43:22.156-08:00www.bellomoarchitects.com
There site has alot more...www.bellomoarchitects.com<br />There site has alot more pictures on this.. very niceYesonHSRnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-21625213615554633482009-11-27T15:56:43.616-08:002009-11-27T15:56:43.616-08:00@ YesonHSR
I think that a design competition woul...@ YesonHSR<br /><br />I think that a design competition would be an excellent idea for the project.<br /><br />The question should be, should a single design be chosen for the entire route, or should different sections have different designs?Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-91212863121230641392009-11-27T15:27:29.678-08:002009-11-27T15:27:29.678-08:00Palo Alto on line has a story and image of a very ...Palo Alto on line has a story and image of a very nice looking proposal for HSRYesonHSRnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-71142530268852029452009-11-27T15:03:10.236-08:002009-11-27T15:03:10.236-08:00It's interesting to note that travel from smal...It's interesting to note that travel from smaller airports worked because of cheap fuel. After all, Southwest Airlines only did well because it had a fuel hedge. Now that fuel prices have been getting higher, and aren't getting lower, airlines are having trouble. I can't imagine what would happen if fuel prices go up in 2010 like they did in 2008. <br /><br />Flights out of Palmdale are defunct, and Ontario is spiraling into oblivion, even though flights at LAX were up this year.<br /><br />So I don't disbelieve what that pilot was saying. It would be far better to handle in-state travel with electric trains, rather than jets.Spokkerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03244298044953214810noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-84425478506862449162009-11-27T14:57:20.086-08:002009-11-27T14:57:20.086-08:00We flew from Long Beach to SFO to visit family in ...We flew from Long Beach to SFO to visit family in San Mateo. Jet Blue is a good airline, but we still had to show up 1.5 hours early to check, which meant getting at taxi at 5:15 am for a 7 am flight (the only one available on Thanksgiving morning, at least when we bought tickets). Then we had to get down to San Mateo.<br /><br />With HSR, we could have left at 8 am, got to Los Angeles for a 9 am train, and been in Redwood cit at 11:30, without being crammed into an airplane or getting stuck in traffic. Faster, more civilized, probably cheaper.<br /><br />On the flight, I sat next to a Jet Blue pilot who was on his way home. He mentioned that they may be pulling out of Long Beach, because the economics are not working out with high fuel prices and the bad economy. Yet another reason to build a new option for in-state travelJosephhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10347867836045599809noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-29343627581304453472009-11-27T13:37:09.740-08:002009-11-27T13:37:09.740-08:00THEY never cease to amaze! Now we shouldn't b...THEY never cease to amaze! Now we shouldn't build high-speed rail because it will use electricity? Unbelievable! What straw will THEY grasp next?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-66462365788029523712009-11-27T13:06:09.737-08:002009-11-27T13:06:09.737-08:00CHSRA can say that they're going to use renewa...CHSRA can say that they're going to use renewables, but while that will provide explicit demand for renewable power and encourage the construction of more renewable generation, every KWH they use will be taken out of the grid. Until their contracted demand produces the incentive to create more renewable power, taking that renewable power out of the grid (not really how that works, but whatever), just makes everyone else's power usage less green.<br /><br />That said, CA's power is already around 50% non-carbon emitting, ie: nuclear, hydro, geothermal, wind and solar. Our coal usage is around 1%, and the remainder is natural gas.<br /><br />Any accounting of HSR's carbon output should look at what is going in to the grid in california, not some fantasy situation where 100% of the electrons are coming from coal, or 100% are coming from renewables.<br /><br />The berkeley paper actually dealt with this, and they showed that CHSRA's carbon usage would be much lower than a hypothetical system, but as far as I can tell they didn't include it in their final analysis, choosing instead to use the hypothetical case of 100% carbon based fuelsUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08878685680339441795noreply@blogger.com