tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post3868460629452038485..comments2023-10-30T09:03:07.163-07:00Comments on California High Speed Rail Blog: Reminder: Menlo Park HSR Town Hall Tonight at 7Robert Cruickshankhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-35126950444204361152009-08-28T13:48:22.161-07:002009-08-28T13:48:22.161-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-29418102842892519222009-08-26T17:43:13.385-07:002009-08-26T17:43:13.385-07:00@lyqwyd: IANAL but that was my take as well. The t...@lyqwyd: IANAL but that was my take as well. The two issues the court agreed with the petitioners were that <br /><br />1: They didn't account for UPRR's statement expressing their "unwillingness to share their tracks with high speed vehicles" between San Jose and Gilroy.<br /><br />2: They had contradictory statements in their own documents about vibration mitigation, in one place saying it is "uncertain whether the reduced vibration levels will be below a significant impact" and then punting the question to the project level EIR, and then in the CEQA saying that the mitigation "will reduce this impact to a less-than significant level".<br /><br /><br />Certainly a setback, but hardly a ruling for Altamont. The vibration impact contradictions would be relevant with any alignment and the UPRR issue could be solved with a signed agreement.<br /><br />The fact that the court ruled that the higher Pacheco ridership numbers were indeed correct, that the Dunbarton rail bridge was not a viable option, that the authority was not biased towards pacheco, that the 101 and 280 were rightfully excluded, that the biological, growth, noise, visual, and tree impacts were properly considered, can hardly be taken as saying "they have to study the other alignments".<br /><br />It's still going down the caltrain corridor. Sorry guys.AndyDuncannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-20291543320553979782009-08-26T17:25:58.196-07:002009-08-26T17:25:58.196-07:00I'm not a lawyer, so my understanding after re...I'm not a lawyer, so my understanding after reading the result could be totally off base, but as far as I understand the court rejected the following arguments by the plaintiff:<br /><br />- failed to use train splitting <br />- failed to adequately describe costs<br />- Pacheco doesn't result in more "recreational ridership"<br />- inadequate biological impacts along Pacheco alignment<br />- inadequate study of growth inducing impacts<br />- inadequate study of noise impacts along Peninsula<br />- inadequate study of visual impacts<br />- inadequate study of tree impacts<br />- that CHSRA was predisposed to Pacheco<br />- that Dumbarton rail bridge was a viable alternative and not properly addressed in EIR<br />- inadequate description of construction challenges of Altamont<br />- CHSRA inappropriately excluded 101 & 280<br />- CHSRA failed to properly respond to Menlo Park's letter<br /><br />To reiterate, the plaintiff claims CHSRA failed to do the above properly, and those claims were rejected by the court, in my mind meaning the above items were all completed according to law.<br />it also rejected Palo Alto's amicus brief.<br /><br />Plaintiff was granted a "writ of mandate", which seems to me to require CHSRA needs to correct the items pointed out above by Morris, but again, I'm not a lawyer.<br /><br />It's not clear to me what, if any, needs to be halted by CHSRA, but it certainly does not seem to mean a new EIR needs to be done, or that the alignment needs to be re-evaluated. I could be entirely wrong, so I will wait for some of the more lawyerly readers to chime in.lyqwydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13246339570684365095noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-42283880543904917232009-08-26T16:53:27.495-07:002009-08-26T16:53:27.495-07:00The ruling is also uploaded as a Scribd embed, inc...The ruling is also uploaded as a Scribd embed, included on the new blog post on this subject.Robert Cruickshankhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-78127827684452384672009-08-26T16:52:53.544-07:002009-08-26T16:52:53.544-07:00The official ruling is posted:
go to
https://ser...The official ruling is posted:<br /><br />go to <br />https://services.saccourt.com/publicdms2/DefaultDMS.aspx<br /><br />case number 80000022 - make sure to select 2008straight_Reportnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-74107549472917844462009-08-26T16:33:44.218-07:002009-08-26T16:33:44.218-07:00AndyDuncan, what they have to do is go back and re...AndyDuncan, what they have to do is go back and research other alignments. The detailed work they are doing now is ONLY for Pacheco. Now they have to go back and revisit Altamont and every other option. They are sunk.Bay Area Residenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15807091317788242756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-71301018238999553422009-08-26T16:32:27.881-07:002009-08-26T16:32:27.881-07:00ROFL this lawsuit news has to be a blow to the Dir...ROFL this lawsuit news has to be a blow to the Diridon centered special interest group also known as the CHSRA.<br /><br />again, ROFLBay Area Residenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15807091317788242756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-90908890973932943362009-08-26T16:28:08.877-07:002009-08-26T16:28:08.877-07:00Face to a name, I'll be the one in a GDR unifo...Face to a name, I'll be the one in a GDR uniform chanting "Berlin Wall forever!"<br /><br />I'm actually already here. Stunning how much the existing tracks already divide the city. You'd think a traffic choked town like this would welcome grade separations.<br /><br />Morris, I'll wait to see the decision for myself. But we all know this will get litigated until one side finally quits.Robert Cruickshankhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06906581839066570472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-52728213221309555852009-08-26T16:26:50.001-07:002009-08-26T16:26:50.001-07:00Sorry:
I meant to say is now posted and not not p...Sorry:<br /><br />I meant to say is <b>now</b> posted and not <b>not</b> posted....Morris Brownnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-45909174379874411192009-08-26T16:24:57.501-07:002009-08-26T16:24:57.501-07:00My understanding is all project level EIR work in ...<i>My understanding is all project level EIR work in the Bay Area must stop until a new program level EIR is circulated and certified.</i><br /><br />So they have to stop the more detailed EIR so they can do a more detailed EIR?AndyDuncannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-31476988017989442012009-08-26T16:24:05.679-07:002009-08-26T16:24:05.679-07:00the full ruing by the Sacramento court on the laws...the full ruing by the Sacramento court on the lawsuit is not posted on their website.<br /><br />Go to:<br /><br />https://services.saccourt.com/publicdms2/DefaultDMS.aspx<br /><br />and fill in<br /><br />2008 as the year<br /><br />and 80000022<br /><br />as the case # and you will get to a whole list of material. The top listing 8/26/09 2:11 PM is the ruling.Morris Brownnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-86098499549613869832009-08-26T16:22:05.477-07:002009-08-26T16:22:05.477-07:00@Morris
Bummer, how about a link? Thanks.@Morris<br /><br />Bummer, how about a link? Thanks.lyqwydhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13246339570684365095noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-44812325018938423722009-08-26T15:55:52.551-07:002009-08-26T15:55:52.551-07:00@ anon @ 2:38pm -
no it doesn't, except as an...@ anon @ 2:38pm -<br /><br />no it doesn't, except as an unfunded separate project to beef up the southern portion of the Capitol Corridor plus ACE and, to include Modesto.<br /><br />SMCTA still has hopes for rehabilitating the 100-year old single-track Dumbarton rail bridge, but that won't happen until it's given back the funding it "borrowed" from the BART extension to Warm Springs to pay for fancy tunnels in the one to SFO.<br /><br />For full-fat HSR service, the northern end of the starter line would have to be split, reducing service frequency to both SF and SJ, at least until ridership levels are high enough.<br /><br />Any new bridge across Dumbarton would have to be tall enough to preserve the shipping lane. An immersion tunnel would also work. Both would stir up a lot of bay mud during construction. The mud is still contaminated with methyl mercury from the Gold Rush era, any concentration jump in the water column could spell disaster for the ecosystem of the nearby wildlife refuge, which includes the habitat of at least one endangered species (Saltmarsh Harvest Mouse).<br /><br />Getting through Union City would also require tunnels, since UPRR isn't going to sell any of its ROW between Newark and Niles. More tunnels would be needed to get to Pleasanton.<br /><br />Perhaps the biggest issue, though, is that there no longer is any viable ROW for dedicated HSR tracks between Union City and San Jose Diridon in the East Bay. VTA purchased the WPML between Niles and east San Jose for the BART extension to Santa Clara, which county voters approved yet again last November. Track stacking on top of BART and/or UPRR's adjacent Milpitas line or else, I-880, would be very expensive and also very ugly. There's also the problem of the nearby and very much active Hayward fault.<br /><br />That means switching from Pacheco to Altamont would mean splitting the HSR starter line on the peninsula, i.e. full grade separation and (probably) quad tracks for the Caltrain Corridor between Redwood City and San Jose Diridon.<br /><br />Altamont would make it easier to meet the SF-LA non-stop line haul time target of 2h42m set in <a href="http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/07-08/bill/asm/ab_3001-3050/ab_3034_bill_20080826_chaptered.html" rel="nofollow">AB3034</a>. Service between the Bay Area and Sacramento would be vastly improved. However, it would be nigh-on impossible to meet the one for San Jose-LA (2h10m).<br /><br />See this <a href="http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=107511680599374219842.000471474af53f25cdcf4&z=10" rel="nofollow">MAP</a> for details. The section through Union City permits an intermodal station with BART but the hwy 84 median and Decoto Rd were not previously studied in the context of the Bay Area to Central Valey EIR/EIS.Rafaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05471957286484454765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-83123238538700397372009-08-26T15:44:04.174-07:002009-08-26T15:44:04.174-07:00The judge has issued a ruling on the lawsuit filed...The judge has issued a ruling on the lawsuit filed by Menlo Park, Atherton, PCL et. al.<br /><br /><b><br />The ruling is favorable to the plaintiffs. A press release is being prepared, but from what little I know now, 4 points winning issues for the plaintiffs.<br /></b><br /><br />- inadequate project description<br />- inadequate analysis of land use issues<br />- finding of mitigation of vibration impacts not supported<br />- failure to recirculate after UP announced that its right-of-way couldn't be used<br /><br />My understanding is all project level EIR work in the Bay Area must stop until a new program level EIR is circulated and certified.<br /><br />Again I'm not an attorney.Morris Brownnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-73549168000762657622009-08-26T14:38:31.346-07:002009-08-26T14:38:31.346-07:00Altamont lives!!!Altamont lives!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-41642334931353357482009-08-26T13:33:23.815-07:002009-08-26T13:33:23.815-07:00@ Peter -
an overhead catenary system is conceptu...@ Peter -<br /><br />an overhead catenary system is conceptually similar to a suspension bridge in that a load-bearing wire holds the one that makes contact with the train's pantograph level. Various designs for the <a href="http://www.railway-technical.com/ohl003.gif" rel="nofollow">webbing</a> have proven successful.<br /><br />The load-bearing wire is tensioned using weights and pulleys. The word "catenary" refers to the mathematical name of the curve a heavy, slender wire will naturally assume when it is pulled taut. In engineering terminology, "overhead catenary" refers narrowly to the power lines used for railway systems.<br /><br />Note that the OCS on an HSR line is arranged in a precise zig-zag pattern to avoid placing excessive thermal and mechanical load on a single point on the pantograph. The set of traction motors on e.g. a fully equipped Alstom AGV is rated at 12,000kW (16,000hp) mechanical power. Even at 25kV electrical tension, that translates to well over 500A of current (there are losses in the transformer, power electronics and motors). If the contact point on the pantograph were constant, it would heat up very quickly. Before long, the wire would cut through it like a saw.<br /><br />The whole OCS system <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CGy2-AptTY" rel="nofollow">vibrates</a> for a while after a train has passed by, which can cause problems at high speed if more than one pantograph is deployed on a single train. Ice accumulation and high winds can also cause vibration problems. Any type of fouling will cause <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzCEF1CUqqk" rel="nofollow">arcing</a>, but that also removes the contamination.<br /><br />When there's limited headroom, e.g. in tunnels, <a href="http://www.railway-technology.com/contractors/electrification/furrer_frey/" rel="nofollow">overhead conductor rails</a> can be used instead. Typically, an aluminum or copper alloy/composite construction is used. Speed is limited to "just" 140mph because the conductor rail doesn't zig-zag, so per-mile wear and tear on the pantograph is higher. The only reason such systems can be used at all is that the contact zone is larger and the electrified rail also an excellent conductor of heat.<br /><br />Note that tunnels excavated using TBMs usually provide enough headroom for attaching a regular OCS directly to the ceiling.Rafaelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05471957286484454765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-2567615055263103512009-08-26T13:33:10.215-07:002009-08-26T13:33:10.215-07:00NONIMBYS said...
All the nimbys will be easily fou...NONIMBYS said...<br />All the nimbys will be easily found<br />They will be loud rude and demanding people..much like the health care town halls..<br /><br /><br />these folks, all of whom are suppose to be mature adults, amaze me with their 1st grade playground antics.<br />maybe its true that when you get old you start to regress.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-63248034237355759102009-08-26T13:31:35.070-07:002009-08-26T13:31:35.070-07:00and please get metro ling out to palm springs.
the...and please get metro ling out to palm springs.<br />then remove the shoofly tracks and use the leftover space for bike trails.<br /><br />that post was a mistake - somehow i pasted part of another post. together with the palm springs comment.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-72479032320185363982009-08-26T13:12:25.970-07:002009-08-26T13:12:25.970-07:00All the nimbys will be easily found
They will be l...All the nimbys will be easily found<br />They will be loud rude and demanding people..much like the health care town halls..NONIMBYSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-81817667918411120752009-08-26T13:00:38.073-07:002009-08-26T13:00:38.073-07:00Tunnel cross-sectional area required for high-spee...Tunnel cross-sectional area required for high-speed rail is 64m^2 for Japanese system and 90m^2 for European system. <br /><br />www.jrtr.net/jrtr48/pdf/f40_Shi.pdf<br /><br />Assuming that bottom half of the circular structure will be used for high-speed rail, required diameter will be 42 ft (for Japanese std) or 50 ft (for European std). Since my estimated does not include thickness of the structures, actual diameter of the circular structure will have to be slightly greater.K.T.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-22272802175383489972009-08-26T12:48:41.556-07:002009-08-26T12:48:41.556-07:00on another note - dear people of LA, please get th...<i>on another note - dear people of LA, please get the red line up to BUR so I don't have to take metrolink all the way to laus, then redline back up to hollywood.</i><br /><br />Working on that.<br /><br /><i>please hurry up and get that purple line out to sta ma. what gives?</i> <br />People on the east side think that light rail makes a good regional rail technology and want us to put their projects ahead of projects like the purple line that, while expensive, still offer higher ridership miles per dollar spent.<br /><br /><i>and be sure to take the green line from lax to the artic station in ANA.</i><br />LAX connection is happening, though who knows what form it will take. Previous plans called for hooking into the people mover, but now the people mover is supposedly cancelled, so who knows where the lines will go to. There's also the Crenshaw line and Harbor Corridor line under consideration to hit LAX. I'm rooting for the Harbor Corridor to be run as an EMU service connecting DT Long Beach to LAX to LAUS, but it's still early in planning.<br /><br />Green line to Arctic is never going to happen. It's looking like we're not even going to get the green line to connect to the Norwalk Metrolink station. At least not for many, many years.<br /><br /><i>and please get metro ling out to palm springs.<br />then remove the shoofly tracks and use the leftover space for bike trails.</i><br /><br />Meh. Quite a low priority. If Palm Springs is ever connected to anything, it will probably be via some far, far off HSR connection to Phoenix.AndyDuncannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-14029218840756268552009-08-26T12:33:22.668-07:002009-08-26T12:33:22.668-07:00The HAT trench as shown on the website looks a lit...The HAT trench as shown on the website looks a little oversimplified. There's no infrastructure for overhead wiring or anything. It looks like they're showing BART-like subway trains to make the design smaller. If you add wiring it will be WAY taller. <br /><br />Terminology side-question: Is all overhead wiring called catenary?Peterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00326948451529910432noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-92136305980191147442009-08-26T11:45:19.058-07:002009-08-26T11:45:19.058-07:00@putting lies and land specualtion? In califo...@putting lies and land specualtion? In california? please say it isn't so.<br /><br />get over it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-32518045752054258752009-08-26T11:43:54.349-07:002009-08-26T11:43:54.349-07:00@rafael
well I think its pretty wel established t...@rafael<br /><br />well I think its pretty wel established that it will be 4 tracks<br /><br />Now stacking, in certain areas may well make sense in that you can have the temp shoofly tracks to one side while diggin down maybe 40 feet, and putting hsr on the bottom two tracks and caltrain and UP on the top 2 (for ventelation) <br /><br /><br />on another note - dear people of LA, please get the red line up to BUR so I don't have to take metrolink all the way to laus, then redline back up to hollywood.<br />please hurry up and get that purple line out to sta ma. what gives?<br /><br />and be sure to take the green line from lax to the artic station in ANA.<br /><br />and please get metro ling out to palm springs.<br /> then remove the shoofly tracks and use the leftover space for bike trails.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4263762637946594105.post-27972232119821027442009-08-26T11:39:37.346-07:002009-08-26T11:39:37.346-07:00@ Robert - If we are at the event - how can we ide...@ Robert - If we are at the event - how can we identify you? <br /><br />Will you be sitting in Mehdi's lap? <br /><br />Or will you have pom poms so we can ID you as the guy who will cheer for the project no matter what the leaders say or do?<br /><br />Through the lies, and the land speculation deals and pre-determined alignments - there's Robert! - <br /><br />Rah Rah HSRPutting a face to the namenoreply@blogger.com